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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:36 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Weight Reduction - Numbers

Hi all,

This last holiday, I have spent some time testing my Eclipse GT. She was "busy" at the shop and tracks during the year, so I previously didnt have much time to play with her.
Btw, I have posted this in the brazilian Mitsubishi Club. English is not my native language, and I dont know the correct english word for all car pieces. I would be very gratefull if you make any correction.

I have started testing some weight reduction "theories" for the 4G. I could read lots of posts about this subject, but i havent got numbers and/or pictures. So I removed and weighted the following items:

- Back-seat;
- Spare tire;
- Tools;
- Trunk cover;
- Trunk floor;

The whole procedure was quite easy. Bellow are the results:

- Lower (horizontal) part of the back-seats: 4.2 Kg
IMG_0749

- Vertical part of the back-seats: 7.2 Kg
IMG_0748

- OEM Subwoofer: 6.9 Kg
IMG_0751

- Spare tire: 12.8 Kg
IMG_0750

- Tools: 4.4 Kg
IMG_0752

- Trunk cover: 2.0 Kg
IMG_0753

I have forgotten the trunk floor in the shop (320 miles away from here). I dont know its weight. Probably about 2Kg (will not include it for now).

See the car after this process:

IMG_0746

IMG_0747

These have given a total weight reduction of 37.5 Kg (82.6 lbs) . With another -12Kg from the coilover/exhaust/cai (I had the car weighted at each wheel in November), I think I have a good starting point for improving its performance.

I have done preliminary tests with my G-Tech Pro RR. I had improved my 0-60 times about 0.1s with just the -37.5kg, as expected from the math at 0-60 mph Calculator - 060calculator.com. I am going to make better measurements and post the results here (it was raining slightly at that day).

Next months, I am planing to go even further:

- Remove passenger seat: -23Kg (50lb);
- Replace driver seat for a Sparco Evo: -18Kg (60lb - 18.5lb);
- Install Volk Racing TE37 wheels: -14Kg;
- FC hood: -15Kg ?;
- FC trunk: -15Kg ?;
- Lighter battery: -10Kg;

Counting the already installed reductions:
- Coilovers: -12Kg;
- Seats, subwooker, spare tire: 37.5Kg

We could have about 145Kg (319 lbs) of total weight reduction, without doing anything not-reversible and keeping the interior quite good. This would translate to something similar to +30hp if I remember the math (1 hp for each 10 lb). That would be fantastic.

A side-effect of removing back-seats and trunk floor: engine sound is louder and more metallic from inside (I loved it).

I have tested these weight reduction in racing simulators (GTR2 and rFactor) where I have been building/modeling my Eclipses for the last months. As expected, the weight reduction improves acceleration, braking and handling. I could reduce my lap times accordingly. I cant wait to test this in the real tracks.

Update (Jun 23rd, 2009):
I have installed the Evo X Small Battery Kit from AMS Performance. The OEM battery is 17.7 Kg, while AMS Battery is 6.8Kg. Its almost 11Kg of weight reduction:








Best regards,
Ziki
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:43 PM   #2 (permalink)
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awesome.......

pull the fuel cover off, and you can pull the interior pieces off the trunk hatch and inside the trunk as well, if you have a rear wiper I hear thats about 25lbs to pull that motor etc......but with the hatch replacement all that goes away neways........
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:48 PM   #3 (permalink)
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if you go to road race engineerings web site, they also have the corner wieghts for a full interior and completely gutted car.
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:49 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Great writeup! You get eRep for that, sir

FYI, the front seats are also their namesake... buckets full of unnecessary weight, if you can spare getting rid of the coil heaters and electronic adjustable mechanism.

A different car altogether, but when I was installing heaters in the 3G seats, they easily weighed over 60lbs each! Also something to consider are the bumper core supports, which, depending on what you're trying to accomplish, are a safety feature that adds on significant weight to the vehicle. But again, it's a risky tradeoff. Then there's also the back hatch and sunroof assembly.
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:49 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danester View Post
awesome.......

pull the fuel cover off, and you can pull the interior pieces off the trunk hatch and inside the trunk as well, if you have a rear wiper I hear thats about 25lbs to pull that motor etc......but with the hatch replacement all that goes away neways........
I have tried to stick to things I could quickly do right before a race..then revert after it. Anyway, that would be a good suggestion, since I cant remember using the rear wiper (I had to check personally in the garage in order to confirm I have it).
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:52 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Great writeup! You get eRep for that, sir

FYI, the front seats are also their namesake... buckets full of unnecessary weight, if you can spare getting rid of the coil heaters and electronic adjustable mechanism.

A different car altogether, but when I was installing heaters in the 3G seats, they easily weighed over 60lbs each!
I have read in this forum that the driver seat has 60 lb, while the passenger has 50 lb. This weekend, I am going to remove and weight them, so we get more exact numbers.
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:54 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I think ACI sells a plug for the hole if you remove the rear wiper, thats a heavy part, and the 08-09's don't have it stock.......I know I don't use mine.......but it would be something you can leave out permanently.......
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Old January 7th, 2009, 11:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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the seat weights depend on whether or not you have the 6 way adjustable or not, mine are just the regular cloth seats, and I pulled the driver side one and I don't think it weighed more than 35.........but I didn't wiegh it........silversniper has some nice lightweight ones installed.......

Finally posting my RIPP SDS 06 GT post 141 on page 4........
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:26 AM   #9 (permalink)
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And for those who're really die hard about keeping their asses hot, you must know that there's a much lighter... and greener ... alternative to having a radiator under your seat...




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And no, Wolf... that's not an ultra-mega-maxi pad
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:38 AM   #10 (permalink)
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yeah, the rear wiper is easy to nuke.

i have taken the passenger seat out of mine, i have heated leather. and just the non automatic seat wieghs 65+ easy
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
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65+!!!! holy hell, that's like having one of your kids in the car with you......I'm soo glad I got cloth with no upgrades, even no sunroof here......
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Yeah but even the cloth ones weigh a ton, Dane. Note that the rails alone weigh a good 15 lbs. Plus the ass-cup and seat back frame.
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:45 AM   #13 (permalink)
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yeah, i went to pick it up and all i could think of was how it felt the same as a really heavy rucksack...

i dont want to know how bad the drivers seat is.
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:45 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:47 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I pulled my cloth non 6 way adjustable, non heated seat out and set it on the garage floor.......if it weighed 40 lbs, I'm a black man with a diamonds in my grille..........
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:51 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Also, another thing for the truly die-hard -

all the AC components will weigh about 100lbs easy. Just the condenser assembly alone will be about 40lbs. Take away all the A/C and heater stuff in the engine bay, and HVAC plumbing in the cabin and you'd already have reduced the weight of your car by a wife or full grown daughter.

A couple of other ideas - engine block underbrace (interior piece) redone in aluminum, aluminum oil pan, aluminum radiator, battery relocation to rear, rear hatch and glass panels... WHEELS...

Lots of opportunities. But not for the daily driven nor faint of heart
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:52 AM   #17 (permalink)
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I got an aluminum oil pan.........tranny pan as well (auto)
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:58 AM   #18 (permalink)
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yeah... lol im fixing to add 100lbs of crap to my car. so there are going to be some things pulled out to make up the difference

but ziki, there isnt much past what you have already done that is easily put back in. unless you start replacing parts with custom lighter pieces... on my 3g i had the little 1/4 windows redone in CF, the rear hatch was lexan, the fuel tank was gone for a fuel cell that was about 1/2 the size, a 'miata' battery, etc...
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Old January 8th, 2009, 01:15 AM   #19 (permalink)
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bed pan?
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Old January 8th, 2009, 09:02 AM   #20 (permalink)
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is this true 10 lbs = 1 hp?
in that case i should be looking into rear hatch cf and fenders
already got the cf hood
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Old January 8th, 2009, 11:26 AM   #21 (permalink)
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the CF fenders wiegh more than the stock fenders...

and no, you don't actually gain HP from losing wieght. thats just a horrible way to say that. every 100lbs you take will equate to .1-.2 off your 1/4mile time
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Old January 8th, 2009, 11:35 AM   #22 (permalink)
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pay attention to the front/rear weight distro. The 4G is already kind of weight-biased towards the front and a lot of those removals are behind the drivers seating position.

A battery relo to the spare tire well will help this some.
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Old January 8th, 2009, 12:45 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Taking the AC out will help the front weight too..
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:06 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I wonder, though, if taking weight off the front any further will do anything to get the car off the line quicker. Of course, it's pertinent to when you're taking the twisties, but for bloated torque and lack of traction?

Damnit --- I have a proposal: why don't the GT gearheads start talking about a solution to getting all four wheels to spin with the accelerator instead?
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:12 AM   #25 (permalink)
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because it would be cheaper to buy a new car........I found a junkyard motor, I plumbed the guys bathroom in his basement,(about 6 hrs labor) and he's bringing it home from his work (the junkyard) next week when he has the flatbed, and I have my cherry picker out of storage.......I'm gonna take a hammer and chisel and crack that sucker open and see what it's gonna take to put some pinkies in that bad boy.........
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:19 AM   #26 (permalink)
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WHAT THE FUCK, DANE??!

You gots yourself a spare 6G74-M?

Good deal, man!







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because it would be cheaper to buy a new car........
Highly doubt that. All we need is a suitable tranny or way to properly affix a tcase and there are so many ways you could source the rest.
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:21 AM   #27 (permalink)
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we'll be lookin' at doing some major head work as well.....I've been following the threads about this and I'm interested........
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:27 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Hmmm... I hate you... Carl style






I'm seriously, SERIOUSLY jealous...
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Old January 9th, 2009, 12:53 AM   #29 (permalink)
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If your talking about at the track Lawrence, then as long as you can get rid of the wheel hop then just get some slicks...
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Old January 9th, 2009, 01:04 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Yeah I guess. Not that I'd really care to gut the car out. I think I've gone past fiddling with that kind of idea that I'm more concerned about giving the car more power than taking away weight. I love its creature comforts as they are, and in truth, if I ever do end up building the engine up and make it go fast, it's likely just for personal satisfaction and closure in knowing that it can, and has been successfully done to the degree I imagined possible.

I'm not going to waste a perfectly good car on showing it off to the world to scrutinize, or to only lose it in some freak accident over bragging rights.

Yeah. I think I'm really getting old...
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Old January 9th, 2009, 03:27 AM   #31 (permalink)
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I wonder, though, if taking weight off the front any further will do anything to get the car off the line quicker. Of course, it's pertinent to when you're taking the twisties, but for bloated torque and lack of traction?

Damnit --- I have a proposal: why don't the GT gearheads start talking about a solution to getting all four wheels to spin with the accelerator instead?
Didnt really look up much but what about the 6 speed VR4 tranny not sure if the mating is even close or not
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Old January 9th, 2009, 11:47 AM   #32 (permalink)
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there are miles of discussion about RWD and AWD swaps. lets keep this thread to wieght reduction stuff.

i have a few solid ideas. and MikeW has even more. they are pretty easy, just expensive. if you wanna talk about it start a new thread.
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Old January 9th, 2009, 01:16 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
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there are miles of discussion about RWD and AWD swaps. lets keep this thread to wieght reduction stuff.

i have a few solid ideas. and MikeW has even more. they are pretty easy, just expensive. if you wanna talk about it start a new thread.
I would like to hear your ideas, but last time I talked about this in another thread, people came with the default answer: "buy another car". I would love to have an Eclipse GT 4G AWD, not an Evo, not a Subaru, just an Eclipse. Would you mind opening such thread in order to discuss your ideas? As a senior member, I think people will respect you more.

Thank you,
Ziki
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Old January 9th, 2009, 05:59 PM   #34 (permalink)
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im pretty sure a search will show them up fairly easy. but let me know if you cant find anything.
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Old January 9th, 2009, 06:56 PM   #35 (permalink)
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ya, that topic has been beat to death a few times......to some its a pipe dream, and to others its just a pipe.......

hey Ziki, are you doing the lightweight rotors and lugs as well? I was looking at some forged aluminum lugs that were literally like 5lbs lighter........that was for all 20 lugs you flamers.......

be sure to drain out your winsheild washer reservoir......its just liquid you don't need........or keep it only 1/4 full if you think you need it on the track........have you pulled all the speakers and stereo equipment out yet? you can get cheezmo speakers that weigh half what the stockies do, and still have some music, it'll just suck........ how about all those airbags? think of pulling those out?
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Old January 10th, 2009, 11:20 AM   #36 (permalink)
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I'm thinking of doing mostly carbon fiber swapping. Carbon fiber hood, hatch, fenders, spoiler, lips/side skirts...The only thing is I have NO idea if the silver of my car is going to look terrible with that much carbon fiber, the front/back lips especially.
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Old January 10th, 2009, 03:03 PM   #37 (permalink)
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^i think it would look SHWEEEET!
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Old February 11th, 2009, 06:14 AM   #38 (permalink)
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i was reading and you guys posted that 10lbs= 1 hp, i thought it was 13.5= 1 hp, well at least for our car!?
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Old February 15th, 2009, 05:39 PM   #39 (permalink)
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this is good info...why is it not stickied?
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Old February 15th, 2009, 06:24 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Subscribed to this thread, very great progress you are inspiring me to do something like this, spring break project HERE I COME.

I am going to pitch in for this thread;
of course this is for hardcore track;
the window motors are pretty darn heavy, gutting the doors would be a pretty significant saving
A lot of great ideas were already mentioned, I am going to do the lightweight battery/ drain some fluid/ get rid of wiper.

depending on your weight you could get on a diet / start working out.
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